NFT is not good idea

I can’t believe… Why nft? CO2 drop free? I will unsubscribe if this is not a joke

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I agree that it is a very confusing move coming from a company such as JimmyJoy. NFTs are built on the Ethereum blockchain. While it’s not as bad as Bitcoin, it’s far from neutral.
More information here: “THE ENVIRONMENTAL ISSUES WITH CRYPTOART WILL BE SOLVED SOON, RIGHT?" | Medium

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I was thinking the same thing. It felt like such a strange move from a company that wants to be more conscious of the environment. NFTs do not have a good reputation for being good for the environment. Our individual behavior makes a difference.

By producing NFTs you are sending a signal that they have value which makes it more lucrative to continue to produce them.

I REALLY don’t understand this move, and strongly disagree with the decision you have made to produce them. If you wanted to do something better you would let us use our points to make a donation to an environmental charity, or something else.

I’m extremely disappointed in the decision. And will strongly consider giving up my subscription after my next shipment if I do not see some sort of response explaining the rationale behind this, as well as what you plan to do to rectify this.

How will you make things better? What charity will you be donating to that works with the environment? Will your employees organize a water clean up day?

I’m looking for concrete answers about how you will rectify this, because one of the major selling points for me on choosing jimmy joy was the environmental aspect. It felt like you were concerned about climate change and the environment more than other brands. If I was wrong in my assumptions then I will in the future be taking my business elsewhere.

I just finished reading a book. Its called Braiding Sweetgrass.

I highly suggest everyone read it. Its such a fantastic book that has really made me more aware of my impact on the environment and the need for me to do more to take care of it.

Please update us with what you plan on doing to make this situation better. (I also want to be clear the ”you” I am directing all of these questions to is Jimmy joy as a brand. Not the person who made this post. I totally agree with them that this is a very strange decision.)

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Good day,

Thanks for expressing your concern. Let me state first and foremost that sustainability is very close to our hearts. It’s the reason we are vegan and we offset our CO2 emissions on shipments and are in talks to to work with Pachama, a company that uses state of the art machine learning to offset our CO2 emissions further than we are already doing with Trees For All. Another example is a protein that we’re developing with partners that is produced by feeding microorganisms waste streams from the food industry, turning waste into something useful.

Me personally and the company are into the latest technology for the greater good of people and the planet. We like to be a part of and create the future for the better. Cryptocurrencies, NFTs and the cryptographic revolution as a whole have the potential to benefit society in numerous of ways; privacy, censorship resistance, decentralising power, checks and balances on inflation, stop banks from privatising profits while socialising loses, digital scarcity, etc. As with all tools they can also be a force of evil; ransomware, inequality, CO2 emissions, etc. which is why I appreciate that you’re expressing your concern and we’re in no way married to the idea of having and continuing to make NFTs.

The way I see the energy use of our NFT is as follows, we paid 2,30 USD to mint the NFTs on the Ethereum blockchain. Thereby we are creating digital scarcity which potentially makes them interesting and fun collectibles. Miners use computation to secure the network and make a profit. If they use 50% on energy, 45% on equipment/rent/labor etc and turn a 5% profit, we paid them 1,15 USD for energy to incorporate our NFTs into a block on the blockchain. If we would have painted images on a canvas it would have been a lot more energy and therefore CO2 intensive. If we would then ship those canvases to Time Travellers it would again be a lot more energy intensive. There are a lot of customers who liked to own the NFT as within minutes we had more addresses to send them to than we have NFTs (we minted one images in an edition of 10). This gives me the idea that we created something of value for the customers that we love with little CO2 emissions. The ethereum block would have been mined regardless of our NFT being in there. If we offset the emission it would be a net good compared to them not being in there.

We feel that cryptocurrencies could be a force of good for the use of sustainable energy. Energy is used in areas with large concentrations of homes, transport, industry , etc. but that is not necessarily where the energy is produced. Lots of energy is wasted because it is created outside the area of use. If excess energy could be put to use, by securing a crypto network, it increases the financial incentive to invest into for example solar energy, functioning as a economic battery. In my opinion the energy use of cryptocurrencies should be viewed in comparison to fiat currencies, to me it’s not a clear loser compared to petrodollars or gold mining for example, I could be wrong of course.

As said the NFT seemed like a nice way to communicate our appreciation for some of our most loyal customers in a futurist way but we’re not married to continuing them.

Best,

Joey

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Thats not true. Right click in the image of twitter, save as… and tadaaaa jpg download, less CO2 than canvas. NFT is only a scam, you dont give nothing. A waste of energy, look at this 9bfe3a2efg8aa1fe. Here you are, I ve generated this hash for you, is linked to Bart Simpsons soul. Enjoy it. Cryptos currently are not as free and happy as you think

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First of all, I really appreciate that you took the time to respond to this thread, Konigsbruggen.

However, I strongly agree with everyone’s opinion here. As the entire internet collectively expresses its disgust with NFTs for their frivolous waste of energy with no actual value, a company that prides itself with being environmentally friendly jumps on the NFT bandwagon? Just comes across as extremely out of touch.

There’s a reason why some cryptocurrencies (ethereum included to my knowledge) are working on a transition to Proof of Space or other Proof ofs, because Proof of Work has been generally accepted as a terrible waste of energy and thus falling out of favor. However, creating a hard disk also wastes energy and water as well as other limited resources, so I don’t really see how proof of space is any better, for example. Both the energy and the hard disk could’ve been used for something useful instead.

I see the benefit in cryptocurrencies, don’t get me wrong. I don’t like them, but I see their worth. But I do not see the benefit in NFTs and Konigsbruggen’s post did not change my mind on that.

Certainly, if the alternative is sending a physical item to the customers, that’s worse in terms of energy required. I’m not questioning that. But it’s not a black and white world, there’s not just these two alternatives. How about an artwork by the Jimmyjoy artist and every winner gets to contribute some ideas, a character on it and/or their name? Purely digital, no physical item required. Could be publicly displaced on the main page or just sent via email. I just don’t see how a cryptographically provable “you’re special now” token is worth… anything, really, let alone the energy required to create it. If it were free to create, sure, but it just so happens to be very controversial…

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I love your idea of having the customers get some sort of digital jimmy joy art. I think maybe a competition where they could help come up with the design that would be used on a bag of plenny shakes, or what would be the instagram photo for a week or something could also be fun!

There are plenty of ideas that would allow us customers to have jimmy joy art, without having an NFT, and without you having to ship out a canvas.

The other option would be to ship a canvas out with someones order? I feel like there are many other ways for you to interract with us, and this one was not one that matches with the way the brand has been marketing itself before. Its a very strange choice.

I agree with @JayEff I can understand the value in cryptocurrencies. I don’t like them either, but I can understand how they could be valuable.

What I think is really strange, @Koningsbruggen is that you think the data would have been mined regardless, and so therefore it doesn’t matter that you did it. I think that kind of is confusing for me, because I think its kind of a ridiculous argument. I mean I could say that someone is going to rob my local store anyways, why shouldn’t i do it first? Like the logic doesn’t hold. Just because someone is doing something bad doesn’t mean that it doesn’t matter what we do.

Each choice that we make counts. Its important. And your answer still has not convinced me that you understand why we are upset about this. I’m glad that you are doing things to help offset your CO2 production. And I’m glad that you are developing new sources for sustainable protein, I think thats awesome!

But I think that you should be aware that while there may have come in lots of emails about getting a NFT from you, those people may not be aware of the environmental impact. its also possible that those people don’t care. But you have plenty of customers who clearly do care and want to know what you will do going forward, and what else you will do to make it better in the future.

I think the thing that is so shocking is how out of touch it feels. Like I thought that this was a brand that prided itself on doing as much good for the environment as possible, i remember one of the posts that convinced to try jimmy joy was when you were sharing the creative ways that people recycled their jimmy joy boxes. I thought it was super cool to see a brand that cared so much about how each part of their products are used. So seeing your defense of NFTs just makes me feel confused and sad.

In the future I would MUCH rather see some sort of digital art that you could send, or some sort of chance to help design the art for a new product. Or something along those lines, as those most certainly take less energy than NFTs.

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Oh stop crying :cry: about Bitcoin and NFT energy consumption. Read this https://endthefud.org/ before you judge and vent your unfounded opinions.

I’m so sick of this carbon neutral, circular, recycling nonsense by people who have no clue what they are talking about.

Bitcoin is the greatest invention since the Internet and NFTs the biggest invention since jimmyjoy. This energy FUD has to stop. https://endthefud.org/

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good grief. stay respectful, needing to underline your point with this many cuss words does not exactly bode well for the actual content of your message. And indeed, all you do is use a straw man fallacy to derail the discussion.

Nobody said “bitcoin is a waste of energy”, we agreed that it has its place. We talk about how NFTs are a waste of energy, and your link addresses those with not so much as a single mention. So, moving on from that straw man of yours, you state “NFTs are the biggest invention since[…]” as if it’s a fact, without supplying any reasoning, not even opinions. Can you perhaps provide some arguments as to why “you’re special” tokens hold any meaning whatsoever?

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NFTs, Bitcoin… Potato Potato, both are blockchain technologies. NFTs allow digital art to be rare and valuable. The same ‘waste of energy’ excuse is used for both Bitcoin and NFTs and most people do not realize the mining of these is done using excess electricity that would otherwise be wasted (gas flaring, wasted hydro energy) as this is the only way to do that at a profit.

The Jimmyjoy brand has always had nice art and those would be cool to be available for purchase online (or giveaways) Even established brands like Sotheby’s and Playboy are jumping on the digital art movement. The fact that you state NFTs are a waste of energy basically says you’re culturally as flat as a pancake because you consider digital art to be a waste.

I may sound angry but refuse my favorite powdered food brand to be hijacked by environmentalists. How dare you!

I think it is shocking how out of touch you are with NFTs, and maybe you really should read a bit more about it before deciding that an NFT would be more polluting than shipping canvas around the world. The best way to stop emitting CO2 is to stop breathing and leave the NFT discussion to people who understand the technology?

Cryptocurrencies and NFTs are just about the greenest inventions of our time. People waste a lot of material and shipping on art that nobody wants, paint, canvas, shipping, etc. NFTs use a fraction of those resources and are minted where the energy is cheap and plentiful (hydropower, thermal energy, etc.) For example, the world’s largest crypto mine is located in Iceland and uses 100% geothermal energy. Many miners in China use the excess hydro energy that would otherwise be wasted because there is not enough electricity demand to consume all the power generated whilst In Texas, excess gas is usually flared off (burned), but nowadays, this flaring of gas is converted into electricity that, you guessed it, is used to mine crypto and NFTs.

Same goes for Bitcoin and is not polluting at all compared to other forms of money like the money in your wallet or on your bank account. The mining of gold is terribly polluting to the environment and often uses slave labor too. The amount of CO2 emitted by minting traditional money and transport of coins (in diesel trucks!) is far more than all the cryptocurrencies combined let alone the datacenters required to keep your financial institution online.

It’s sad to see that the most vocal people on forums like these know absolutely nothing about modern technology and still seem to live in the stone age. Shocking and angers me a lot quite honest.

BTW: Did you know that all the ‘NFT and Crypto Engery FUD’ originates from assumptions made from a report that was based on a lot of other assumptions that was written by someone who works at the DNB? The dutch central bank… responsible for your ‘other’ money… go figure…

I personally would LOVE the JJ art as NFTs, they make the perfect collectables, are funny and can swap them with friends. They are much eco friendlier than any poster or T-Shirt you can send in the mail and are a great way to advertise your brand.

Christie’s, Charmin, MGS Entertainment, Taco Bell, Pizza Hut Canada, Pringles (Owned by Kellogg Company), Nike and many other large brands already did this so it makes perfect sense for Jimmyjoy to join the bandwagon.

The cartoons that accompany JJ products just deserve to shine in the spotlights and if they would be animated it would make them even more desirable.

Please don’t let a few (non timetraveller?) clients decide on the faith of the company.

BTW: WHY WAS THIS POST FLAGGED AGAIN? MODS PLEASE STEP IN HERE…

Sad to see some treehuggers here are silencing posts by abusing the flagging system to ‘report’ anyone that challenges their opinion…

Surely the difference is that if you shipped out canvas paintings people would actually have paintings, whereas people gain nothing of value from an NFT that couldn’t be gained by just sending them a digital image file as an attachment on an email?

The fact that it’s apparently permitted on this forum to call people with environmental concerns “smelly tree-hugging hippie sh*t” is also a bit alarming

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So a copy of a painting is just as valuable as the original painting? Your comment makes absolutely no sense. NFTs are rare and therefore have value. emailed images are not, therefore have no value. I would love to have the Jimmyjoy cartoons as an NFT and would collect them all. I honestly don’t care about a poster or emailed image.

Thank you for deleting your inflammatory language.

So a copy of a painting is just as valuable as the original painting? Your comment makes absolutely no sense. NFTs are rare and therefore have value. emailed images are not, therefore have no value. I would love to have the Jimmyjoy cartoons as an NFT and would collect them all. I honestly don’t care about a poster or emailed image.

The painting was worked on by the artist with his own hands and is physically different from any copies, digital art can be instantly, perfectly, copied. If you find value in owning NFTs then good for you I suppose, I don’t really see the appeal but you are free to buy a token saying you own a piece of digital media if you so choose. However, Jimmy Joy markets itself as an environmentally sustainable company and must weigh up the pros and cons of offering you your wish - presently Etherium uses about as much energy as the nation of Peru in order to sustain what is at best a niche interest, which hardly seems like a sustainable system for providing people with fun collectibles.

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Did you know that all the ‘NFT and Crypto Energy FUD’ originates from assumptions made from a single report that was based on a lot of other assumptions that were written by someone who works at the DNB? The Dutch central bank… responsible for your ‘other’ money… go figure…

Energy used is usually green energy that would otherwise be wasted. Excess hydropower that no consumer wants at the moment it is generated, thermal energy, gas flaring, etc. Roughly 67.8% of all energy produced is wasted and it is cryptocurrency mining that actually turns this, otherwise wasted energy into something useful like sound money, defi or for example certifying digital art in the case of NFTs.

Personally I think JimmyJoy would make a good impression with NFTs as it shows they embrace technology and are a forward looking company working on a better planet, just like the food they produce.

My 2 cts.

BTW: I really dislike hippies…

I’m not really sure that the occupation of the authors of one report on some of the energy consumption of cryptocurrencies is relevant here, given that it’s backed up by others nobody has disputed its conclusions and various crypto companies, including Ethereum, have themselves acknowledged that they use too much energy.

Also I had a look at that link you posted and it is…partisan to say the least, appears to be entirely focused on defending the honour of Bitcoin and in fact includes in its list several articles claiming that Ethereum (and any non-Bitcoin cryptocurrency) is a doomed and worthless compared to Bitcoin, and has a whole section about how Proof of Stake, which Ethereum is switching to, is a terrible system, which hardly seems to make the case for Ethereum-based NFTs. I’m also not sure what your hatred of 1960s counterculture has to do with this topic.

Regardless we’re going way off topic here, I’m just registering my opinion that NFTs and Jimmy Joy’s sustainable brand don’t really go that well together.

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Let’s agree to disagree. JimmyJoy is the future of food and NFTs are the future of art. JimmyJoy uses art to promote their brand and as such it makes sense to promote it in an environmental sound way via NFTs instead of (super cool but polluting) cotton T-Shirts and PVC stickers.

BTW: Keep sending me those shirts and stickers! I :heart: them!

Of all people, I wasn’t expecting to see you here, Martijn. Happy to see that you like JimmyJoy, however, you might want to disclose who you are and your relation with cryptocurrencies before attacking folks ad-hominem and proselyting with the same talking points from /r/bitcoin

I’m so sick of this carbon neutral, circular, recycling nonsense by people who have no clue what they are talking about.

I opened my first wallet in 2013, I worked as a developer on an altcoin wallet and today, I hodl some PoS cryptos. I understand and believe in the potential of blockchains and digital art. I happen, like you, to be opinionated towards it.

@Koningsbruggen It’s your business, you have the choice. If the type of clients that you want are @martijnw, power to you, it’s a free market.

For the other reading this. Please believe me when I say that @martijnw doesn’t represent the crypto community. Some of the most brilliant minds on this planet are at work to create innovative blockchain-based frameworks that have sustainability at their core.

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